NC Store Posts ‘No Weapons Allowed’ Sign - Gets Robbed

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skb12172
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Re: NC Store Posts ‘No Weapons Allowed’ Sign - Gets Robbed

Post by skb12172 »

Hmmm….speaking of Dr. Gratia Hupp, the first commenter on this article doesn't seem to get it.
JohnKeller
I first started feeling sorry for Miss Hupp but as her story continued I only got callous. Gun control did not kill her parents, a man with a gun killed them. Gun control may have saved them from him. Do you really want untrained people walking around with guns, spraying the crowd with lead looking for a shooter? I suggest she look for ways to curb violence, not blame gun control on a killer.
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http://hereandnow.wbur.org/2013/01/22/suzanna-hupp-guns
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HTRN
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Re: NC Store Posts ‘No Weapons Allowed’ Sign - Gets Robbed

Post by HTRN »

skb12172 wrote:[All the same, it's a good exercise. My employer has the same policy. If somebody bursts through the door and starts shooting, is my employer liable, since they don't want me to carry my concealed piece, though state law allows me to do so?
No, they're not liable. It's been explained a dozen different times here, corporations are not responsible for criminal acts by third parties, but they would be for anything that was permitted under corporate policies by third parties on their property or by agents in their employ. You assume responsibility for your own safety by walking through the door. Don't like it? Don't go in.
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Termite
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Re: NC Store Posts ‘No Weapons Allowed’ Sign - Gets Robbed

Post by Termite »

If I feel the need to CCW in a restaurant with a "No Firearms" sign, I'll do it.

CCW means CONCEALED, so unless they install metal detectors or pat-down stations, HTF would they know?
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D5CAV
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Re: NC Store Posts ‘No Weapons Allowed’ Sign - Gets Robbed

Post by D5CAV »

HTRN wrote:No, they're not liable. It's been explained a dozen different times here, corporations are not responsible for criminal acts by third parties, but they would be for anything that was permitted under corporate policies by third parties on their property or by agents in their employ. You assume responsibility for your own safety by walking through the door. Don't like it? Don't go in.
You are correct.

However, this is based on case law where corporations are not asking anything more than abiding by US and local laws. As I said, Suzanna Gratia had no case against Luby's because Luby's had nothing to do with a criminal act.

I think it would be smarter from a liability standpoint for the corporation to be silent, since dictating actions that are otherwise legal require responsibilities on the part of the corporation.

Let's take the thought experiment further. Let's say a restaurant decides to offer meals "roman style" with bare feet and toga for patrons. To maintain the "theme" patrons must remove their shoes. Many of us feel that shoes are useful for a number of reasons and wouldn't remove them otherwise.

A "crazed prankster" scatters shards of broken glass in the restaurant and a number of patrons suffer cut feet. Security video shows that the broken glass is the fault of the "crazed prankster" - a criminal act that the restaurant had no control over.

However, since the restaurant was asking patrons to remove the one piece of kit that is perfectly legal, and could be argued would have prevented them from injury, wouldn't the restaurant have a higher duty to spend more manpower to keep the floor cleaned?
None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free.” Johann Wolfgang von Goethe
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Aglifter
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Re: NC Store Posts ‘No Weapons Allowed’ Sign - Gets Robbed

Post by Aglifter »

Not aware of any cases on point, but IMO, D5Cav has a much more sound legal argument.

There have been a few cases where corps were held responsible for criminal acts by third parties, but A) The legal reasoning there wasn't the best, and isn't considered that reliable, and B) The π's main claim, as I recall, was that the corp didn't take reasonable steps to discourage criminal behavior.
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NVGdude
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Re: NC Store Posts ‘No Weapons Allowed’ Sign - Gets Robbed

Post by NVGdude »

D5CAV wrote: Essay question:
Does Suzanna's daughter now have a tort against Luby's for the wrongful death of her parents? Why or why not? Please cite relevant case law. You have 20 minutes.
Honestly I think that there is an assumed liability.
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